Login |  Register




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090314 04:25 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
I'm bound to be talking about this a lot over the next several months, so here's a thread for it. The prior thread was not about the actual album, it was about who should accompany me.

The main question coming into this endeavor is: What TYPE of album should this be?

I have two basic styles, a lyrical verse chorus style and an instrumentally-focused experimental style. My early experimental albums were really... really not great. To the extent that I've stricken all of them from the official canon (granted with some formative verse chorus albums as well). Even my prior two instrumentally-focused albums (Drug Abuse and Isolate The Masses) show a lot of promise but are quite a bit too sloppy to be considered generally listenable. My lastest experiment, Subversive Voice, however, is my crowning achievement thus far and I keep finding myself saying "This Albini album will be a solid second, but it can't beat Subversive Voice." And 2nd place won't cut it for a $4,000 album. (Granted, the experience of recording with Albini is more important to me than the output).

Considering that my goal is to produce something potentially popular, my initial instinct is to produce something more verse chorus. Most likely something similar to the 'rock' style of Bisexual Anthems, a verse chorus album with a few forays into relatively accessible experimentation. But the one thing that makes me stop and think... is the fact that metal & experimental music work on a whole different wavelength than mainstream music. If I'm trying for popular music, how many billions of *more* people am I competing against for those fans & record contracts!? It's a serious concern.

Go to any open stage and you can find at least a handful of people who are technically far better at the verse chorus style than I am. They don't have the songwriting I do, but I'm sure many, many people out there do. There are probably billions of more people trying to make it big in the verse chorus realm than there are people trying for the metal and experimental realms. Perhaps more importantly, metal and experimental music have their very own infrastructure, independent of the mainstream. There are countless independent labels who cater solely to non-mainstream audiences, countless massive independent labels who bring us bands like Opeth, Darkthrone, and a million bands you've never heard of. If hypothetically my noise-metal album and my verse-chorus rock album would be of equal quality, would I not have a far greater chance of making it big in noise-metal than in rock, because I'm facing less competition for the opportunities available? There is a much, much larger market for popular rock. But there is a much, much larger group of competitors. Considering that every dude who picks up an acoustic guitar trys to be a songwriter, I daresay I have a better chance at making it big with noise-metal.

I can't help but to feel that I may have been born for the less conventional path. What I mean by that is, could I ever hope to compete in the verse chorus crowd? Could I **ever** stand up against neutral Milk Hotel and Tom Petty in a commercial sense? Doesn't their squeaky-clean musicianship make me obsolete? Couldn't I...fare better against Burzum, AIDS Wolf and Rapeman? The experimental crowd responds to things like raw recordings, unconventional ideas and uncommercial content. Doesn't this sound like a much, much, MUCH more receptive audience for what I have to offer? On the other hand, I have a million times more experience in verse chorus than I do in noise-metal. Do I really know anything about noise and metal? Do I think my stuff is more legit because I subconciously respect & understand the form less? I mean, I had never listened to professional noise a month ago. And yet, some bands have proven you don't need to be familiar with a style of music to do it well, and my lack of 'training' in that area could result in all-important uniqueness. Uniqueness is probably the most important thing unless you're a musical virtuoso.

Until I see how Subversive Voice (er, Post-Apocalyptic Anti-Social nihilism) fares on CDBaby, for the time being I will focus on creating the spiritual third in the rock trilogy of BA and SubPop Is So Commercial. If I had only a year to live and I would have good reason to haul myself up in Electrical Audio for a week recording a piece of work strictly and solely for my own amusement, noise-metal it would be. But for the time being, a pop-leaning balance seems more appropriate.

Here's the --very tentative-- tracklist I am thinking of. My plan is to work on the electric material with Albini and then record acoustic songs at Blue Home if my time with Albini runs out.

Title: Hanging Out Behind a Sunoco At 4am on a Tuesday

1. I Only Smoke Cigarettes When I Do Heroin (inst.)
2. The Beautifully Dark Power of Light Drugs
3. Leah James
4. Kelsey (Traditional)
5. Suite Jesus
6. Acid Walk Morning
7. Exiles on Mainstreet (inst.)
8. Sweet Alabama Liquid Snake
9. I Could Have Been normal
10. Even In His Youth (nirvana cover)
11. So-So Alright
12. Insatiable Lust for the Twilight Air
(Secret track: Doug Donoughe, cassette recording '06)

Theoretically this album works well because it brings together indie-folk, noise and black metal, all of which are popular with the same hip audiences today. The two instrumental tracks are as-of-yet non-existant, they're supposed to be noise instrumentals, the first one being a subtle build-up for "Beautifully Dark..." and the second one being an AIDS Wolf inspired noise-rock thing. Insatiable Lust for the Twilight Air is also as-of-yet-unwritten, it's supposed to be a new 8-or-so-minute Subversive Voice type track with extra Darkthrone-ic heaviness, using all I've learned from Sub-Voice to make the best track of that type I can. Even in His Youth is my chance to let loose and have fun, being viciously unique with my vocals to carve out something interesting and drum up interest in my music on Youtube and such, covers are always good for exposure.

The biggest problem I see is the fact that I have 3 epic acoustic story songs on here. That's gotta be dragging on for a lot of people. I just generally consider those songs to be my best. I'm sure it's pretty difficult to judge just based on this stuff but I would much appreciate opinions on the tracklist, like what songs should or should not be included.

*Also the last 3 songs (incl. secret) are probably the 3 longest, 3 out of the top 4 at the least. Those should probably be spread out.

*For range's sake I should probably do one song where the vocals are totally subdued and soft, since Even In His Youth will be totally all-out (including skat). I Could Have Been normal may be a good candidate, or if thatis a gruff GG vocals song then perhaps Liquid Snake.

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090317 02:43 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
God I love Black noise! The straight-noise Kratom sessions did not go so well. But I couldn't get the black metal out of my head. And I kept loving Subversive Voice. And I realized that all my last 3 albums so far were all harder edged, music based experimental things. Almost like I'm a real harder edged experimental musician! I never thought I could grow-up past my folk roots, never thought I could be electric at all. So I decided to pick up right where Subversive Voice left off, and do an album just like that, but having to build on it because you've already done it, progressing naturally... you know, just like a band does it. And the sessions have been very promising so far.

I'm starting to want to go with the blackness for the Albini album; not entirely but a lot more of it.

What if I changed the whole idea behind the album, start at square one... with some kind of a Rust never Sleeps motif! Imagine something like that... half indie rock, half black noise...! Something like...

1. Beautifully Dark Power of Light Drugs
2. Sweet Alabama Liquid Snake
3. Leah James
4. Acid Walk Morning
5. So-So Alright
6. I Could Have Been normal
7. Even In His Youth
8. *
9. *
10. *
11. *
12. *

*black noise metal songs not yet titled... or existing.

bahahahaha... maybe I'm high and excited but this sounds awesome. an indie black Rust... it's not too unoriginal, is it? I mean, will it seem stupid, campy for me to copy Rust never Sleeps like that? Would I be better off crafting my own unique thing? But I mean, how many albums like the original plan are there already? Millions? There are maybe a handful of Rust styled albums. I don't think the bits of diversity in the original plan make it its own unique entity.

The big question is... what kind of a name could go with something like this? I thought I had finally found something meaningful with "Hanging Out Behind a Sunoco At 4am on a Tuesday." It's very important to me that this album makes sense, without that it's just a bunch of singles. But I don't think that title would make any sense for an album that is a whole 50% black noise. And am I killing a potentially great album with this completely ludicrous idea? "Hanging Out..." could be my Aeroplane and I don't know it. But damn this Rust idea sounds cool. Best of both worlds!

But does it novelize my black metal too much, by placing it within a neil Young construct? People already question my metal cred because I'm not a purist. But no, it makes the black metal so much more a part of the whole. It was more a novelty when there was only one track of it.

is the album not commercail enough? Or maybe it's more viable now. Or does it eliminate all audiences by putting together two things that nobody but me would ever like? My folk isn't exactly the type of indie that Burzum and AIDS Wolf-listening fans listen too... and only 1 out of every million extreme metal fans listen to indie. OR does it make it uniquely notable through its bizarre dichotomy? Meh, who knows?

I need a name. That's the most important issue because if I could (long shot) come up with a name for this as good as "Hanging Out..." then it would be a no-brainer.

It's also important to wonder whether anybody at all actually could dig my black noise. I love it oh so much but maybe I'm the only one. I mean, I used to like Isolate The Masses. What if this stuff is just utterly terrible? !?

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090317 02:53 
Legendary Overfiend
Legendary Overfiend
User avatar
Joined: 090226 11:19
Posts: 527
Location: Terminal Dogma
IfTheLightTakesUs wrote:
What if this stuff is just utterly terrible? !?

:lol:

If Liz Phair can get away with recording a followup to Exile on Main St., and Kid Rock can get away with ripping off the cover to Live Bullet, I don't think you should worry about copying the Rust pattern. The important question is whether or not the pattern is truly the one you want to use.

Also, I would say not to worry about being "legit" in the eyes of the black noise/metal crowd. You may want to be accepted by them, sure, but the thing that makes you you is that you're so unique. Remember, you can't stand out by trying to fit in.

As for whether or not or how far you should go commercial in your endeavor, that's a tough question that I wouldn't know how to answer.

_________________
I see what you did there.
Image


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090317 21:27 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
Work has been the most condusive thing to my creative process... it gives me a lot of time to think. Knew I'd come up with a title at work. At first I came up with Dextromethorphan for the title and it was bloody perfect... But then it occured to me that it might be a little disingenuous. This rust album would probably not be a good album for orphan tripping and I wouldn't want people judginig it based on howit sounds on DXM. See... even though I wouldn't even know how to play black metal without DXM, subversive voice doesn't sound that great on it. On mary jane subversive voice is so powerful that it's LIKE being on DXM. So I figured that on DXM it would like change my life... but then I tried it and it really isn't the right album for DXM. So then it hit me... Marijuana! Marijuana could be the album title.

It's a lot less unique... MJ doesn't have the black metal noise kind of image that DXM can... But it's a good idea. Because that makes the concept kind of work. It's like you're hanging out with your friends, acquiring the drugs, taking the drugs... Then the trip takes over and you're in another world. Oh wait, did I forget to tell you about the other idea I came up with? Think: Morrison Hotel. The album could be in two parts, each with its own name, so I can perserve the original name.

Keith Cohen
Marijuana

Part One: Hanging Out Behind a Sunoco At 4am On a Tuesday
1. Beautifully Dark Power of Light Drugs
2. Sweet Alabama Liquid Snake
3. Leah James
4. Acid Walk Morning
5. So-So Alright
6. I Could Have Been normal
7. Even In His Youth

Part Two: Tripping Balls (or... Dextromethorphan?)
8. *
9. *
10. *
11. *
12. *

But it should probably be a harder drug...

Also came up with a couple of song titles...

Simmering Sonata For Slaughtering Socialites in Summer
Rave Up for the Dark Lord

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090317 23:46 
Legendary Overfiend
Legendary Overfiend
User avatar
Joined: 090226 11:19
Posts: 527
Location: Terminal Dogma
Frankly, I think the idea's ridiculous, but reading your descriptions of how albums sound under the influence of certain chemicals, I can't help thinking that it's like "wine recommendations" in a fancy restaurant. Hypnotoad's new album? Good choice. Might I recommend listening to it on DXM? :3eyes:

_________________
I see what you did there.
Image


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090318 16:12 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
Well, what's ridiculous about it? In what way is it ridiculous? I'm not trying to contradict you, I just would very much like to know. Is it ridiculous as in naming an album "Cereal" might be ridiculous? 'Cause I think that'd be a cool name, I like associating an album with a thing because it elevates both of them to be more meaningful. Is it ridiculous because I'm reappropriating popular drugs, like it's a bit pretentious to do that? 'Cause I just think it's accurate. I dunno.

I see it as being the logical progression from the iconography we already use in music. An album like In the Aeroplane Over The Sea is the utter embodiment of all that youthful mystique, the drugs and romance and all of that. I like simple, perfect concepts, I'd like that album even more if it was named Marijuana. Something like First Kiss or Love or whatever might have meaning if that's not the kind of crap that crappy pop artists have been using as album titles since the dawn of time.

Also... Dr. Dre's big album is named The Chronic, another name for weed. I didn't even think of that... that kind of dampens it a bit.

DXM > MJ as an album title. Unfortunately to make the album particularly good on DXM it would have to be either very upbeat & densely musical, brutal-as-fuck pristinely-produced metal, or noise. I lack the musical chops for the first two and I wouldn't be able to do a straight-up noise album yet, nor would I particularly want to abandon everything else just so I can call the album Dextromethorphan.

Anyway my plan right now is to do the Subversive Voice follow-up and then start working on my first verse-chorus album in YEARS! Hopefully to get one or two more recent songs for the Albini project, but that's a long shot. The funny thing is... the roles are reversed. I used to be able to bank on the chorusey folk being easy as hell to nail, so much so that my last folk album was almost all improvised, chords and lyrics and everything live at once. But now it's the opposite... I can sit down at the 4-track and do some passable black noise at any given moment. But I'm quite worried I won't be able to write any good new folk songs.

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090318 23:16 
Legendary Overfiend
Legendary Overfiend
User avatar
Joined: 090226 11:19
Posts: 527
Location: Terminal Dogma
Actually, the idea I was referring to as ridiculous was my own - the idea of presenting albums with drug recommendations. And the reason I personally think it's ridiculous is because I'm obviously not into the whole listening to music while under the influence thing.

IfTheLightTakesUs wrote:
Anyway my plan right now is to do the Subversive Voice follow-up and then start working on my first verse-chorus album in YEARS!

Make sure you throw in a few bridges to keep the audience on their toes! :lol:

_________________
I see what you did there.
Image


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090318 23:46 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
oh, I see. In a perfect world we could do that kind of stuff. It'd be fun and funny. Imagine a culture where people did my stuff instead of wine tasting. How much more tuned-in that culture would be!

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 
 Post subject: Re: The Albini Album
PostPosted: 090405 02:17 
Deserter
User avatar
Joined: 090226 22:52
Posts: 103
Update...

I haven't much thought about the Albini album since last post. Plans for it have been put on hold while I make 3 other albums (Solitary Disillusioned Glory, The Loner's Manifesto and Bagel) before returning to the Albini album material and concepts. But thanks to Surfer Rosa I've been thinking about it again, particularly all day today at work.

The main thing Surfer Rosa has inspired in me so far is a ferocious love of SHORTnESS. I've listened to Surfer Rosa one or two times a day for the last like 5 days. Part of what makes it so perfect and so relistenable is that it is only 33 minutes long. Truth be told, I prefer shorter records. 80 minute records drag. I don't want artists to release *fewer* tracks, they should go back to shorter records, release records more often and have a chance to put together more concepts rather than trying to shove a whole years worth of their material into one disc and trying to make all of that work together in album form. For a long time I have wanted to follow my own plan and release shorter albums, but I have a hard time not stuffing lots of material in there because I always have a lot of material. I never want to save anything for the proverbial 2-disc 20th anniversery deluxe edition... But the confines of 2 days in the studio and the inspiration from the 33 minute perfection of Surfer Rosa sounds like the perfect motivation to finally restart the shorter album tradition. I can also think of maybe splitting Solitary Disillusioned Glory into two seperate albums if I end up with 80 minutes recorded for it.

For the Albini album, I might even try and get it to be (exactly) 33 minutes in tribute to Surfer Rosa. It'd be kind of cool if I had a bunch of classic album references like the Rust format and the 2 name album like Morrisond Hotel, and it might kind of drive home the point that I am 100% about the idea of the album format being an artistic endeavor. The hard part of course is fitting all the shit I want on this album and actually cutting it down to 33 minutes. Pixies songs seem suprisingly short all of a sudden.... Here is the tracklist I was thinking of at work....

Keith Cohen (first actual band logo coming soon)
Marijuana
recorded by Steve Albini

part one: Hanging Out Behind a Sunoco at 4am On a Tuesday

1. The Beautifully Dark Power of Light Drugs (4 m)
2. Leah James (fuzzy band version) (2 m)
3. I Could Have Been normal (5 m)
4. Even In His Youth (2&1/2 m)
5. Acid Walk Morning (2&1/2 m)
6. So-So Alright (6&1/2 m)

part two: Tripping Balls

7.* (5 m)
8. Rave Up For the Dark Lord (3 m)
9.* (4 m)
10. Insatiable Lust for the Twilight Air (7 m)

Times are approximate. Unfortunately, that's much too long. Which is... depressing. I want the album to be short. But I don't want to cut anything out. I don't know where I would even begin, ya know? I'v already cut it down so much.

Also Surfer Rosa inspires me to be as out there and unique as I can, it reminds me that being a unique musical experience is 100 times more important than being a pretty sounding band. If you're unique, people have to come to you to hear what you have to offer. What it means for me is not being afraid to take chances and be very overt, be very enthusiastic and big. Be as 'me' as I can, wild vocals, ridiculous anti-anti-anti-solos (relatively normal-styled solos that are ridiculously terrible). Pixies had surf rock inluences and I think that's totally random and fairly impressive. I was wondering if I have anything that unique I can offer in my music. I was thinking maybe some skat singing.

Oh, it's also absolutely paramount that all the tracks flow together. not too any really deep extent, but the feedback from the last song should always resonate past the start (or at least up to the start) of the next song. I think my tracklist right now works pretty well thematically.

'Course I can't help wondering if Kelsey ought to replace Leah James and/or if Sweet Alabama Liquid Snake should be on there...

_________________
"If I could take it all back now, I wouldn't. I would have did more shit that people said that I shouldn't." - Marshall Mathers

"I hardly ever leave my house or my neighborhood really, and that's not a sad thing." - Fiona Apple

"It's alright, ma. It's life and life only." - Bob Dylan


Profile  Offline
 

Display posts from previous:  Sort by  

Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

Panel

Top You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum
Search for:
Jump to:  
 cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Dizayn Ercan Koc